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Post by Sulvarbir on Jul 1, 2019 13:19:17 GMT
Hi,
I'm new to wood turning but do understand the need for correctly sharpened tools. I've purchased a ProEdge Deluxe last week.
I am looking to find out how to sharpen the Sorby Diamond Parting Tool. This is not shown in the company promotional video and I have not seen it on many of the ProEdge reviews on YouTube.
Any advice or guidance (pointing in the right direction) will be appreciated.
Kind Regards
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Post by Pete on Jul 1, 2019 14:55:12 GMT
I have the standard rather than the diamond parting tool, I sharpen that to an edge of 60° so I set the table to 30° put the V block on the guide to give me a 90° angle then holding the parting tool to the block I push it forward giving equal sharpening time to each side of the blade to keep the cutting edge central. pause while I pop back to the workshop with a camera....  With the diamond profile you will need to be sure your thumb is holding the parting tool exactly upright, but it is the same issue as an oval skew and you soon get used to it. If it pulls to the side in the next piece of wood you cut then you were not at 90° to the belt. |
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Post by sulvarbir on Jul 2, 2019 5:06:23 GMT
Hi Pete,
Thanks for the advice & photo. I shall give it a go.
Kind Regards
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Post by sulvarbir on Jul 8, 2019 19:42:51 GMT
Hi Pete, as you can see it didn't go very well. I'm now worried I may bugger it completely. Theres obviously two much pressure/bias on one side. I did try to keep it as close to 90degrees and the table was set to 30 degrees. There must be something to do this for numpties that Sorby offer. I have done lots of looking with very little result. Bak to the drawing board methinks. Kind Regards Attachments:
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Post by Pete on Jul 8, 2019 21:56:47 GMT
OK first things first.... hmmm it looks like either it is not a 30° angle that you need, or you are lifting the back of the tool from the table so getting a steeper angle....
Lets start by getting the angle right, you could measure it with a gauge if you have one, OR mark the bevel with a marker pen, eye up the table position that puts the whole bevel flat on the belt and fix the table at that angle. turn the belt a little by hand and be sure the ink is removed evenly along the whole bevel. once established write it on the handle with a sharpie so you will always know... if it is 30° then don't lift the back off the table!
Once the angle is established and set, yes you are right you are being too heavy handed.
Without straining support the tool flat to the platform and firm to the V Block that gets the tool presentation square, then gently slide if forward to touch the belt without any part front or back leaving the table, and by eye and touch held at 90° to the V Block (n.b. once you get used to the tool then you will get the feel of it being straight so won't need the v block).
For practice may I suggest you put your finest belt on the PE, mark up both sides of the tool with marker pen, get it held right and just touch the belt if the pen comes off evenly you have presented it correctly, do that a few times and you will get the feel without losing too much metal. then you can change the belt and sharpen it fully with practice and a close to sharp tool it should take 1 or 2 seconds per side to get it perfect again.
When I started out I bought a very cheep Chinese made set of tools from Ebay, and just ground the hell out of them until I could get them sharp just by feel without jigs, while I prefer to use jigs on my expensive tools for repeat accuracy, it is nice to know I can get a cutting edge that is somewhere near without them.
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Post by Pete on Jul 9, 2019 14:16:34 GMT
Hi Sulvarbir
The correct angle for the diamond parting tool is 25°, I have checked with Sorby staff. My tools have evolved with me so what I use isn't necessarily standard, or correct!
So set the table to 25° then do the marker pen trick as above to get the feel of it.
Pete
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Post by sulvarbir on Jul 9, 2019 15:46:31 GMT
Cheers Pete, I’ll try and get in the garage tonight & see how it works out.
I appreciate your advice on this.
Kind Regards
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Post by phoneman on Jul 9, 2019 18:16:47 GMT
Sulvarbir,
I second Pete's advice. I would add one thing: When we are driving and looking for something like a house number, we drive more slowly. The same logic can apply when sharpening. Start with a lighter touch, a finer grit belt, and a black marker. You will very soon develo a sense of whether you are on or off course. The same thought process works with sharpening chisels. Don't wait until you have ground a lot of steel out of square. Correct early.
You will very soon be grinding the way you want! Focused practice makes perfect.
phoneman
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Post by sulvarbir on Jul 9, 2019 19:20:36 GMT
Phoneman,
Thanks for the support. I’m used to keeping my Pfiel carving chisels keen along with a couple of decent axes. Moved into the lathe as my knees couldn’t cope with a pole lathe I built at North Wales woodland centre.
I’m okay with the roughing gouge along with the spindle & bowl gouge. As you suggested taking it gently. Just struggling with the parting tool which I can’t get the angle of the dangle on.
Every day’s a school day except this is an expensive one.
Kind Regards
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Post by phoneman on Jul 9, 2019 21:42:19 GMT
Upon rereading this thread, I realized I basically repeated Pete's advice. That's a good sign; my turning/sharpening skills must be improving!  phoneman |
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Post by Pete on Jul 9, 2019 22:56:33 GMT
False modesty Phoneman, there is nothing I could teach you and much I could learn from you on sharpening. Though I may possibly have the edge on turning It is all confidence and removing a layer of ink instead of steel, saves the tool and builds muscle memory. Please come back and chat when you have had a play Sulvarbir, be nice to know how you got on. |
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Post by phoneman on Jul 16, 2019 12:52:55 GMT
When paying the tuition for Sharpening 101, the currency is tool steel. If we learn, the currency is well spent.
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Post by Pete on Jul 30, 2019 10:51:50 GMT
Don't know what happened to Sulvarbir, but it just so happens I got timber greedy on a production run yesterday and was consequently working very close to the chuck, yes you guessed it, knocked the corner off my parting tool. SO after a decade of sharpening at 30° as I had to take off significant steel anyway I decided to try 25°. so now my 6mm parting tool is sharpened to factory spec.
It really doesn't make much difference to the cutting, gives a longer bevel so may be easier to maintain the edge. and my first attempt had a slight skew so I had to go back and refine it a little. How I did it:- - First set the table to 90°
- Using the side of the V block as a guide I took off the tip of the tool to the back of the damaged area.
- Using a square off the edge of the parting tool I put 3 pencil lines across the shaft of the parting tool, then with a center guide found each centre and drew another line along the tool to the tip giving me a guide to where the cutting edge should be.
- Using a 60 grit belt I then re-profiled the tool at 25° spinning regularly to take even amounts from both sides and cooling in water when it got warm
- Once my bevel was in I crept up on the sharp edge mark working through 120 and 240 grit
- Visually it looked perfect, but tested on a piece of timber and there was a slight pull to the side indicating a slight skew that my eyes couldn't see.
- Retouched on the 240 grit and it was perfect.
- Don't normally bother with this, but as I had put work into the tool I finished off on the buffing wheel and also a couple of strokes on the diamond file to each edge to be sure there was no sideways burr and the tool looks better than new (though a bit shorter!)
It cuts well, I have rolled a few beads, used it as a parting tool as a small skew, and a negative rake scraper all working very well. I have not tried a lace bobbin, but I haven't made them in years anyway. Maybe the factory does know best.... will keep the 3mm one at 30° for now and maybe will give myself 5mm extra timber between finished piece and chuck next time (until I am short of timber again!)
If you are still out there Sulvarbir, would love to hear that you are now a confident sharpener. As Phoneman said the currency of learning to sharpen on any system is tool steel, it's worth paying. |
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Post by sulvarbir on Aug 13, 2019 18:05:54 GMT
Hi Pete & Phoneman,
Yep I’m still here. Just to let you both know I took a long drive to Turners Retreat today to do their 3.5hrs tool sharpening course. I now know how to deal with the diamond parting tool plus a couple of other nuggets of knowledge
I also took a few Pfeil wood carving tools & was given advice on them. All in all a useful day, a long drive but hopefully onwards and upwards.
Mahalo
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Post by Pete on Aug 14, 2019 0:51:03 GMT
I have bought nice things from Turners Retreat, is it worth a visit? Spoken on the phone they sound nice and knowledgeable, its 180 miles from me, so would need a reasonable excuse. So 3½ hours proper training, that makes you our go to guy on the sharpening from now on Please tell me if after your training my advice above could be improved, I like to be helpful when possible so need to know if I get it wrong. I am finding the 25° grind about the same as my previous 30° apparently the wood doesn't care though the slightly longer bevel does make it slightly easier to freehand sharpen with the diamond card I use to just touch up the edge. Pete |
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